SIGN UP THREAD - Bushcraftoz knife - final specs and price - Sign up here to confirm

Randall

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My thought: I wouldn't do it. Each knife and design has it's strengths and weaknesses. Your knife looks like a scandi grind - very popular with hard use bushcraft type knives. One of the advantages is ease of free hand sharpening. If you commit to a secondary bevel, it will be thick behind the edge, and over time will only get thicker. If you stick to the scandi grind the thickness behind the edge will not increase and you'll still have the advantage of the scandi grind. If you do commit to a second bevel you will have to remove a lot of steel to get back to a scandi if you ever change your mind. I'd just use your enzo for carving.
 

Askew

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I'm not sure reprofiling is the way to go considering the amount of steel you'd need to remove. Is sharpness the issue or blade thickness? Personally I'd carry a knife for carving or accept that the knife I'm carrying isn't the best carver.
 

Taplow

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I'm not sure reprofiling is the way to go considering the amount of steel you'd need to remove. Is sharpness the issue or blade thickness? Personally I'd carry a knife for carving or accept that the knife I'm carrying isn't the best carver.
Thanks guys, you've got me thinking more clearly on this.

Right now the BCOz blade appears sharper than the Enzo - at the low end of shaving sharp - but definitely not as aggressive on dry gum. The blade is thicker but the geometry is actually quite different (higher grind) so that in theory it should have a smaller edge angle, and this does seem to be the case when looking at the two edges. That doesn't add up, but then I noticed a significant microbevel on the BCOz knife but not on the Enzo. Perhaps the microbevel is the source of the problem, and I could try to remove it by laying the blade directly on a stone.
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Randall

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Ahh, that's a bummer. Yes, a micro bevel will be thicker behind the edge, and will only get thicker if you continue to sharpen that micro bevel. It will take a lot of work to get that back to scandi though. I don't know what I'd do. Although now that I see it better, I think that is a sabre grind (the top knife). The bottom knife is a scandi. Sabre grinds are meant to have a secondary bevel. As a design it is meant to be between full flat and scandi. It won't be as thick behind the edge as a scandi with a micro bevel. It could be that the secondary bevel is something like 25 degrees instead of 20 for example. Again, that would have been a choice in knife design (whatever angle it is). 25 is tougher, for harder use, like a cleaver or axe (although my axe is 20). 20 is better slicer, but not as tough, more likely to chip of fold with hard use like batonning. If it came with this edge I would keep it as is and use it for its strengths, rather than focus on its weaknesses. If you insisted on changing the angle of the bevel, 20 should be safe, and not a lot of steel to remove - assuming it is currently 25. I can't imagine it being more. It will be a lot of work on the lansky unless you have the diamond stones.
 
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Randall

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Just found this info on sabre grind: "This additional uniform-thickness metal on the top portion of the blade will add strength and weight, thus making it quite suitable for military as well as heavy use. As with the flat grind, a secondary bevel will often be used. "
 

Aussie123

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I must admit I considered regrinding to a full scandi too, which I'd prefer.

I wasn't sure how much effort it would take and didn't go ahead with it;
but I did purchase a cheap set of diamond stones which I thought I wouldn't mind sacrificing to get the stock removal done

- save the Lansky for the final sharpen
 

Askew

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Had a look at mine and it's got the secondary bevel. Then dug out another knife which had come with a secondary bevel which I'd changed to full scandi which did make it better for carving. Wasn't too much work from memory.
 

Randall

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Had a look at mine and it's got the secondary bevel. Then dug out another knife which had come with a secondary bevel which I'd changed to full scandi which did make it better for carving. Wasn't too much work from memory.
Yes, again, it looks like a sabre grind. It is meant to have a secondary bevel, the scandi isn't. It shouldn't take much to make that secondary bevel 20 degrees if it isn't alreaady. This would be relatively economical regards the life of your knife - you'd only be taking some steel from the shoulder of the secondary bevel.
 

pap11y

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Still love my BCOz knife - weight in the hand, comfort, looks, quality and the fact it was specifically designed for us (thanks again Pap11y).

My only niggle is that it doesn't carve wood, especially dry hardwood, as easily as other knives I have, prime example my Enzo Trapper. Elsewhere in this thread or in related threads people mentioned getting knives with different edge profiles or even reprofiling the edge. I recently got a Lansky sharpening system which makes that a possibility - options range from 17, 20, 25 and 30° angles. Has anyone done something like this and would they recommend it? Perhaps I should leave things alone and use this knife for other purposes, but woodcarving is probably the main use for me. Any thoughts welcome.
So I was typing my thoughts on this then I thought why speculate.. Got mt knife (its been blackened - yes that may qualify me as a mall-ninja-bushcrafter) but whatever..

Had a quick go at carving and I wasn't able to get a curl.

I took this to 20 degrees on the grinder and its made a huge difference..

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So heres my original comments which explain my reasoning.

***
I agree with a lot you have brought up. Heres my thoughts on it..

The difference between the knives is the enzo is scandi grind (zero bevel) and I'm sure the bushcraftoz knife is flatgrind with convexed edge (forgive me its been a while :)).

I think each has pros and cons i.e. scandi carving and splitting wood is very good, but edge can be weaker. Flat with convex is better at cutting and slicing tasks and theres more steel behind your knife edge so its less likely to roll/chip.

I think you could definitely reprofile the edge to 17 and 20 especially if you are carving. In thinking about it maybe a convexed edge would not sit flat like a scandi or secondary bevel making it harder to control..

***

I say reprofile the edge. It won't be as durable but thats the trade off for better carving control..

Wow that was quite an adventure :D Hope the info helps

I don't think it will take you long either..
 
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Randall

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So I was typing my thoughts on this then I thought why speculate.. Got mt knife (its been blackened - yes that may qualify me as a mall-ninja-bushcrafter) but whatever..

Had a quick go at carving and I wasn't able to get a curl.

I took this to 20 degrees on the grinder and its made a huge difference..



So heres my original comments which explain my reasoning.

***
I agree with a lot you have brought up. Heres my thoughts on it..

The difference between the knives is the enzo is scandi grind (zero bevel) and I'm sure the bushcraftoz knife is flatgrind with convexed edge (forgive me its been a while :)).

I think each has pros and cons i.e. scandi carving and splitting wood is very good, but edge can be weaker. Flat with convex is better at cutting and slicing tasks and theres more steel behind your knife edge so its less likely to roll/chip.

I think you could definitely reprofile the edge to 17 and 20 especially if you are carving. In thinking about it maybe a convexed edge would not sit flat like a scandi or secondary bevel making it harder to control..

***

I say reprofile the edge. It won't be as durable but thats the trade off for better carving control..

Wow that was quite an adventure :D Hope the info helps

I don't think it will take you long either..
I don't think you'll lose much, if anything, in durability. I have a cheap, soft axe at 20 degrees, and it amazes me at how well it keeps an edge, even after cutting up dry eucalypt. Also, Cedric and Ada, the youtuber, has done a shitload of cut tests with sissal rope. Most of the time a 17 degree knife will out perform the same knife with 20 degree bevel. It was a good move, with no loss of life on your knife.

Flat grind is flat from the spine down.
 
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Taplow

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Gotta love this forum!!! Thanks to everyone for all the advice.

So I've gone from one position to the other and back again. I could leave the BCOz knife edge as is, use it for tasks that play to its strengths not weaknesses. However being able to use it around camp for jobs like pot hooks etc is very tempting. Looks like it shouldn't be too hard to get a 20° edge on it and improve its carving suitability. And yet, I do recall that the edge on the Enzo suffered when I cut some tent pegs from hard dry gum sticks, rolling a bit and needing some TLC.

In the end, I know myself: I can't leave well enough alone, and will eventually give it a go. "Don't fix it, if it isn't broken" isn't one of my sayings...
 

pap11y

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Gotta love this forum!!! Thanks to everyone for all the advice.

So I've gone from one position to the other and back again. I could leave the BCOz knife edge as is, use it for tasks that play to its strengths not weaknesses. However being able to use it around camp for jobs like pot hooks etc is very tempting. Looks like it shouldn't be too hard to get a 20° edge on it and improve its carving suitability. And yet, I do recall that the edge on the Enzo suffered when I cut some tent pegs from hard dry gum sticks, rolling a bit and needing some TLC.

In the end, I know myself: I can't leave well enough alone, and will eventually give it a go. "Don't fix it, if it isn't broken" isn't one of my sayings...
Have fun mate :) I think it made a big difference and let us know your thoughts when done..
 

Taplow

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You were right pap11y, it did make a big difference! I'd recommend the procedure to anyone who's wondering whether or not to attempt it. I've had the Lansky system for about 3 weeks now and have been practising on old kitchen knives to build up my confidence.

I used the complete range of diamond hones from extra coarse, which very quickly established a new bevel, to the sapphire stone (2000 grit) and leather strop.

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27159

With each hone, I kept flipping the blade over and doing the other side until I could barely feel the burr that formed underneath each time. Usually this meant two good efforts on each side and one or two light efforts.

At the end of the process, the blade was at the high end of shaving sharp and carved chunks rather than little nicks out of some cedar arrow shaft offcuts very nicely (right hand side versus left hand of offcut)

27161

The next day I gave it a tough workout alongside my Enzo Trapper. I used a hard dry stick of bottlebrush (I think) to rough out a badly thought-out pot hanger, swapping between the two blades at each stage.

The difference between the old and new BCOz knife performance was like comparing chalk with cheese. Instead of getting frustrated and feeling hotspots in the handle, it was a lot a fun to use. By the end, it was still at the low end of shaving sharp.

Interestingly the Enzo was not shaving sharp to begin with but still carved a little better during this task and I'm not really sure why. I calculated it has a 20° blade angle to about 1/3 of the blade, and possibly a microbevel due to my work on it a year ago to fix up a rolled edge. The BCOz blade now has a small 20° edge then an even narrower angle to the centre of the blade.

Overall I'm really pleased, and will be taking the BCOz knife out much more often.

27162
 

Mountainwalker

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You were right pap11y, it did make a big difference! I'd recommend the procedure to anyone who's wondering whether or not to attempt it. I've had the Lansky system for about 3 weeks now and have been practising on old kitchen knives to build up my confidence.

I used the complete range of diamond hones from extra coarse, which very quickly established a new bevel, to the sapphire stone (2000 grit) and leather strop.

View attachment 27158

View attachment 27159

With each hone, I kept flipping the blade over and doing the other side until I could barely feel the burr that formed underneath each time. Usually this meant two good efforts on each side and one or two light efforts.

At the end of the process, the blade was at the high end of shaving sharp and carved chunks rather than little nicks out of some cedar arrow shaft offcuts very nicely (right hand side versus left hand of offcut)

View attachment 27161

The next day I gave it a tough workout alongside my Enzo Trapper. I used a hard dry stick of bottlebrush (I think) to rough out a badly thought-out pot hanger, swapping between the two blades at each stage.

The difference between the old and new BCOz knife performance was like comparing chalk with cheese. Instead of getting frustrated and feeling hotspots in the handle, it was a lot a fun to use. By the end, it was still at the low end of shaving sharp.

Interestingly the Enzo was not shaving sharp to begin with but still carved a little better during this task and I'm not really sure why. I calculated it has a 20° blade angle to about 1/3 of the blade, and possibly a microbevel due to my work on it a year ago to fix up a rolled edge. The BCOz blade now has a small 20° edge then an even narrower angle to the centre of the blade.

Overall I'm really pleased, and will be taking the BCOz knife out much more often.

View attachment 27162
Stumbled across this thread today after dusting off my BushcraftOz blade. Sitting in a box for a few years. Must confess I wasn't a fan of the original edge for the reasons stated by others. I actually used the Lanksy sharpening kit for the first today. Think I might do the reprofile on the weekend.
 

Aussie123

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Stumbled across this thread today after dusting off my BushcraftOz blade. Sitting in a box for a few years. Must confess I wasn't a fan of the original edge for the reasons stated by others. I actually used the Lanksy sharpening kit for the first today. Think I might do the reprofile on the weekend.
Let me know how you go.... Its still a job I'd like to do one day, but hasn't been a priority
 
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